In a world that loves to talk, do, achieve, promote, preach, sell....what does it mean to connect, be, and listen. A podcast about #humanconnection #mentalhealth #socialhealth #empathy #belonging and #loneliness. And always thinking about justice and inclusion in all things. Join us. And share far and wide. Or start your own chapter of Sidewalk Talk in your community. www.sidewalk-talk.org
Episodes
Thursday Mar 23, 2023
Thursday Mar 23, 2023
Dawn Menken, PhD. has been working in the field of psychology and facilitator development for over 35 years. She is an internationally respected educator, therapist, leadership coach, and conflict resolution specialist. She co-founded the Process Work Institute, a not-for-profit graduate school dedicated to the training of facilitators, where she co-created its Masters's programs and served as academic dean for more than a decade. She is the author of Facilitating a More Union: A Guide for Politicians and Leaders, which offers a radical and innovative approach to political discourse. She is also the author of the award-winning book Raising Parents Raising Kids: Hands-on Wisdom for the Next Generation. In all of her endeavors, she is moved to improve social discourse and inspire more meaningful civic engagement.
Join Traci and Dawn as they explore the foundations of process work and how it can help us shift out of polarization. Dawn reads the most beautiful speech she would give to the Charlottesville rioters. In this speech she overcomes her terror as a Jewish woman and models how we all can confront our addiction to “other” by speaking both ferociously and compassionately.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet Dawn
- [4:19] Professor Ben Thompson introduces Dawn to Arnold Mindell’s work during a class on the books of Carlos Castaneda about the Yaqui Mexican Indian Sorcerer, Don Juan Matus
- [9:29] What is the Dreambody?
- [11:47] Working On Body Symptoms
- [17:25] Norms or how we “should” be and busting out of stereotypes
- [21:11] The embodied unconscious
- [25:14] Otherizing and polarizing as a global human tendency
- [31:56] Dawn’s speech to the white nationalists in Charlottesville
- [36:09] Breaking our own addiction to othering people
- [43:32] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Facilitating a More Perfect Union (Book)
Raising Parents Raising Kids (Book)
Standout Quotes
- “...it's more about trying to explore what is emergent and trying to happen in you.” (Dawn)
- “I want to add the idea that we don't just have a platform and advocate for our one-sided views, but the facilitator or the leader must position herself also as a facilitator because you're not just leading one section of the world. We have to find a way to get along and to facilitate dialog.” (Dawn)
- “It's about the human tendency to otherize someone.” (Dawn)
- “This whole idea of otherizing is about how we also, as individuals, marginalize different parts of ourselves. Wholeness is really about connecting and getting on with that with which we marginalize internally, in our relationships, and in the world at large. (Dawn)
- “With all my years on this planet Earth, I am more interested in my larger goals of democracy and people getting along.” (Dawn)
- “...how to reach out to a side that you feel is so repulsive to you, and at the same time, take a stand. How to do both at the same time.” (Dawn)
- “I want to tell those protesters that deep down you have more in common with those whom you battle. You're looking for your place, that precious feeling of belonging and pride. (Dawn)
- It is the deepest human longing for all people who risk everything and flee violent circumstances to reside in these United States of America. There is room enough for all of us. (Dawn)
- We all need to feel our pride and sense of home without denigrating others. It is the only way forward. Feel pride in your vision to live in a country that insists on freedom and belonging for all people. (Dawn)
- Being one-sided is very addictive.
- If you have a humanistic view, if you have a view of people and community, the deepest religions talk about that. If you want to connect, if you want to understand and get along, then you have to go beyond your one-sided position. (Dawn)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Dr. Dawn Menken
On Instagram: @processworkinstitute
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Friday Mar 17, 2023
Friday Mar 17, 2023
Rosa supports leaders and groups around the world to work creatively with divergent perspectives. Her mission is developing our collective capacity to transform friction into useful energy and greater insight. Author of From Conflict to Creative Collaboration, a manual on Dynamic Facilitation. She also just finished her Ph.D. so soon we should say Dr. Rosa Zubizaretta. This has freed up her time to take on new clients after some time steeped in academia.
What would happen if helping a neighbor with a conflict was as normal as waking up in the morning? What if our companies had an ethos that conflict is not only natural but good and has a hearty system for restoring after conflict? That is what Traci and Rosa discuss as well as why we need to not start with our most difficult political rivals but make resolving conflict with those close to us our first order of business.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [1:41] Meet Rosa
- [3:21] Rosa’s contribution to the Sidewalk Talk Bus Tour
- [5:23] German and European ties
- [7:16] We need each other
- [8:51] De shame yourself
- [11:42] Common causes of conflict
- [15:43] How conflict is in heaven
- [18:56] Dominic Barter’s restorative circles
- [25:40] Start where it is easy
- [33:30] Love wrestling with your husband
- [38:08] Passionate conflict is an energy turbine
- [41:32] The roots of violence
- [46:18] Closing
- [48:35] Outro
Resources Mentioned
From Conflict to Creative Collaboration (Book)
Standout Quotes
- “I just want to start with the fact that as human beings, we get into messes with each other” (Rosa)
- “Anybody can learn how to hold space productively for another person and listen deeply.” (Rosa)
- “If the 99 % could figure out how to do collaboration between us, we'd be so F* strong,” (Rosa)
- “But we grew up in a culture where we do not learn how to confront people with love. ” (Rosa)
- “Conflict happens when we're at our edge. It's like, there's an edge there. There's something that I don't know or understand yet, or something's getting triggered or something. And so it's a potential growth place. ” (Rosa)
- “I think conflict is a potentially renewable, sustainable source of energy ” (Rosa)
- “We just have to open the space so that we are not butt heads against each other, but that that passion gets harnessed.” (Rosa)
Connect
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Rosa Zubizarreta
On LinkedIn: @rosazubizarreta
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Wednesday Mar 08, 2023
Wednesday Mar 08, 2023
Julio Maria Muhorro is a power coach, facilitator, and speaker. He uses his 10 years of experience in management, training, and research to enable entrepreneurs, leaders, and organizations to tap into their power so that they can engage with their stakeholders from a place of deep purpose, sharpen their offerings to deliver innovative services and digital products and tell transformational stories to drive long-lasting social and economic impact.
Join Traci in a conversation with Julio where Traci asks Julio, “How can I use my power wisely?” Julio will lay out three concrete steps you will need to take and give you a heads-up on the significant resistance you will likely meet. This is a podcast where you will likely want something to take notes with nearby.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [2:58] Meet Julio
- [3:48] It isn’t about wealth and achievement
- [6:57] Saudade - Portuguese word to long to be with
- [11:16] It’s what you do with your power that counts
- [13:01] The will of nature and the will of the divine trumps human will
- [16:08] Three steps to using your power
- [25:54] Powerful on the sidewalk
- [29:55] Sharing your power with the right people
- [34:15] Boundaries and what is sacred
- [40:30] Closing
- [42:42] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Never Been Done Before Global Facilitator’s Community
Standout Quotes
- “Power is tricky because we are real shitheads with power.” (Traci)
- “Power is not something that it can be given or taken from you because you are powerful because you exist.” (Julio)
- “...remember, you're not controlling your life. You are leading the co-creation of it.” (Julio)
- “A lot of the times there is a disassociation between what people are saying about you and how you see yourself.” (Julio)
- “We show up today not based on our performance and results that we achieved in the past, but based on what we believe is possible in the future.” (Julio)
- “It's getting in alignment with all the different wills, the human will, the natural will, and the divine will to choose the right people to be in this virtuous circle with.” (Traci)
- “What will it take for you to live in power now? Not to rest in power, not to have a powerful moment or a powerful day tomorrow, but to live in power now.” (Julio)
- “If you're not able to see the sacredness in you, everything else will fall apart. Because even if people are trying to honor that sacredness, you don't feel as though you deserve it. So you will sabotage it, you will deflect it.” (Julio)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Julio Maria Muhorro
At Link Tree
On Instagram: @liveinpowernow
On LinkedIn: @juliomuhorro
On TikTokr: @liveinpowernow
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Friday Mar 03, 2023
Friday Mar 03, 2023
Thomas Lanthaler drops into hot spots of crisis all over the world and helps people make decisions to get through the chaos as peacefully as possible.
He is an experienced international crisis leader, experiential facilitator, and speaker with nearly two decades of experience across 30 countries. Thomas is the Founder and CEO of The Crisis Compass. This cross-sectoral consultancy acts as a partner and guide to companies genuinely interested in working with a crisis as a means for innovation. He advises leaders on all aspects of human-centered crisis management, confident decision-making, and making businesses crisis-ready using innovative tools to deal with uncertainty and challenging situations - all centered around learning and communication to reframe crises into means of reinvention.
In this episode of the Sidewalk Talk podcast, you will get an inside view of the life of a humanitarian crisis manager and learn what crisis management even is. Then you will have the chance to go on a deep and soulful journey with Thomas as he experienced a new way of thinking about community care and self-responsibility while training with aboriginal leaders in Australia.
Episode Timeline
-
[00:09] Intro
-
[0:58] Meet Thomas
-
[7:35] Becoming a crisis manager
-
[11:17] Fatherhood and how children are natural crisis managers
-
[13:32] What is crisis management
-
[17:21] When we label things a crisis
-
[25:15] What are your non-negotiables?
-
[31:40] Ritual and spirituality
-
[39:17] An earth-based practice of collectivism
-
[48:46] Closing
-
[49:40] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Navigating Beyond Crisis (Book)
Standout Quotes
-
“If you make a small difference with just one person, you've already made a difference.” (Thomas)
-
“A crisis is not an event. A crisis is basically the aftermath of it.” (Thomas)
-
“If it's not a life or death crisis, no one is dying in front of you, there's always time.” (Thomas)
-
“I deserve the acceptance here, but I also have to give acceptance because others are different and they will see it differently.” (Thomas)
-
“I'm talking about the awareness, what it does to me if I actually let go.” (Thomas)
-
“We're trying to do what you just talked about, sitting there on the land, trying to practice collectivism.” (Traci)
Connect
Find | Sidewalk Talk
At sidewalk-talk.org
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
At Traciruble.com
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Thomas Lahnthaler
At www.thecrisiscompass.com
On LinkedIn: @thomaslahnthaler
On Medium:@thomas-89340
Subscribe to this podcast
On Spotify
On YouTube
Tuesday Feb 21, 2023
Tuesday Feb 21, 2023
Dr. Tracy Brower is a PhD sociologist and vice president of workplace insights for Steelcase. She is the author of The Secrets to Happiness at Work and Bring Work to Life, as well as a contributor to Forbes.com and Fast Company.
Traci and Tracy sort through information on workplace happiness and how the workplace meets important needs in our lives for happiness, meaning, and belonging. Not everyone wants to be friends with their co-workers but we do get an important sense of identity and belonging from our work that cannot be overlooked.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet Tracy
- [4:19] Human connection and feeling of community is critical for our work.
- [7:19] The workplace is an important place of stability and identity that is important to our well-being.
- [14:19] Comparison goals like wealth and status don’t lead to happiness.
- [17:08] List of the top 5 happiness producers in our lives.
- [25:08] What leads to workplace burnout?
- [34:27] Friendship, friendliness, and trust in our workplace relationships.
- [43:06] Closing
- [43:32] Outro
Resources Mentioned
The Secrets to Happiness At Work (Book)
Bring Work to Life (Book)
Standout Quotes
- the thing that I'm thinking about work is just how critical it is that we appreciate it as part of a full life, not the only part of our life, but part of a full life.” (Tracy)
- I think we can get into this almost like a vicious cycle of I don't feel connected, I don't feel as valued, therefore, I don't connect as much, and I don't feel as valued.” (Tracy)
- “Whenever we get our roots disconnected from our community, we have a psychological reaction to that from a deep attachment place, from a psychological place in us. For some of us, what happens is we do have to find a villain in that narrative.” (Traci)
- “One of the things that's correlated with happiness is focusing on the community, focusing on what I'm giving. More generosity is correlated with happiness, and more self-focus is negatively correlated with happiness.” (Tracy)
- Sometimes we think of purpose with a capital P, and if I'm not changing the world. But really, it's just the thing that we do well. We wake up in the morning and do well for the people that we care about and for our work community and our broader community.” (Tracy)
- Usually, the best team bonding happens through task where we're rolling up our sleeves together and working on a new initiative or solving a problem.” (Tracy)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Dr. Tracy Brower
On Instagram: @tlb108
On LinkedIn: @tracybrowerphd
On Twitter: @tracybrower108
SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST
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Wednesday Dec 07, 2022
Wednesday Dec 07, 2022
David Bedrick is a psychological activist - an ally to the unheard and marginalized voices inside individuals and the culture at large.
Join Traci as she discusses body image, body-shame and diet culture with David, which is also the subject of David’s book: You can’t judge a Body by its Cover: 17 Women’s Stories of Hunger, Body Shame, and Redemption.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet David
- [2:39] How David (a white man from New York) came to write a book about women’s bodies
- [9:33] How David’s longing to be witnessed led to him become a witness to others
- [13:42] Psychological Activism
- [14:48] What’s cooking?
- [29:40] The inner paradox of diet culture
- [38:12] How you can find David
- [41:43] David’s message to the Sidewalk Talk volunteers
- [43:06] Closing
- [43:32] Outro
Resources Mentioned
You can’t judge a Body by its Cover: 17 Women’s Stories of Hunger, Body Shame, and Redemption (David’s book)
Standout Quotes
- “The idea of having a witness to somebody else's suffering my own and other people's bodies and difficulties became a very important thing to me.” (David)
- “So my fascination or hunger to learn from other people was really important to me.” (David)
- “The word that's just coming into the foreground is this deep longing that you had to be witnessed, that you've now been transmuted into as the witnesser.” (Traci)
- “What happens if I'm not seen or I'm looked at as a problem and not as a source of brilliance or beauty or creativity?” (David)
- “Are you trying to make everyone a sliced piece of really boring American cheese where we're all plasticy wrapped up in that cellophane wrapper so that we're convenient and we go back to work and we're not a pain in the ass?” (Traci)
- “And what I hear you advocating for is the beauty, the wisdom, the complexity, the nuance, the multigenerational story that a soul holds, and the fixed idea of psychology sometimes doesn't do a very good job of gestating.” (Traci)
- “Research says 98% of women have violent voices in their head every day about their bodies. And it's not minor violent. Not like that doesn't look good on you. I'm not talking about that. I would repeat them, but then we'd have to slow down and hear them because they're so gross.” (David)
- “Oh, my god. So what if what if all of us women are going on diets and choosing to fail the diets because it's the actual way that we're trying to rise up against patriarchy to say fuck you to the diet.” (Traci)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | David Bedrick
In Two Deep (David’s podcast): https://www.intwodeep.com/
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Tuesday Nov 22, 2022
Tuesday Nov 22, 2022
Andrea Scher is a writer, artist and life coach whose work is driven by her belief in the transformative power of wonder for creativity and wellbeing. For nearly two decades, through her award-winning blog Superhero Journal, her international workshops, her Creative Superheroes podcast, and bestselling e-courses, she has thrilled others with their own power to find magic all around them.
Join this conversation for a celebration of joy, love, friendship and the wonder of wonder.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:57] Meet Andrea
- [3:20] A peek inside Andrea’s birthday and book release party
- [4:43] How Andrea’s experiences of depression and anxiety led her to become a seeker of wonder
- [6:26] Who Andrea is in the world
- [8:12] How Andrea leads people to their own joy and delight
- [9:27] How to recognise a Full Body Yes
- [10:37] How Andrea used her Full Body Yes to meet some extraordinary people through online dating
- [11:36] Desire tracking (and what gets in the way of us doing it)
- [13:00] The people who have most inspired Andrea
- [17:34] The creative spark that birthed Andrea’s book
- [21:14] Putting on your Wonder Goggles
- [26:11] Negativity bias
- [29:27] How we can cultivate wonder in our relationships
- [30:54] Andrea’s (platonic) rendezvous with a beautiful man on a flight from Milan
- [37:34] Andrea’s message to the Sidewalk Talk volunteers
- [39:49] Closing
- [40:44] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Wonder Seeker (Andrea’s book)
Superhero Journal (Andrea’s blog)
Standout Quotes
- “I think what I like to do is help people move toward their delight and move toward what feels joyful for them, what feels delicious to them.” (Andrea)
- “a lot of times we're just living this life in this sort of default, unconscious way, and we're not pursuing what actually makes us feel joyful. So that's what I'm sort of orienting people toward.” (Andrea)
- “Isn't the body amazing at giving us cues and how often we're living in our heads?” (Traci)
- “We’re not even tracking our own desire and our own wanting, because we're already thinking about, well, what does this other person need and what do they want and what's convenient for them?” (Andrea)
- “I'm so grateful that this dream happened when I turned 50 because I feel like I can hold the joy of it fully.” (Andrea)
- “It's not an accidental thing that when you invite it in and put yourself in the way of wonder, you actually set your life up to have more and more of it.” (Traci)
- “we need to train our brain to also scan for what's good and what's beautiful and what's working in order to sort of, like, kind of balance the scales neurologically so that we have a chance at feeling more joy.” (Andrea)
- “There's a way that your life is always speaking to us, whether that means, like, our higher self is speaking to us, our spirit is speaking to us, or the mystery, it really doesn't matter how you name it, but yeah, I think that's so beautiful and absolutely the way I move through the world, and it feels like magic.” (Andrea)
- “Curiosity is key because we think we know things. We think we know. We think we know what wonder means. We think we know who our partner is. We think there's nothing new to discover.” (Andrea)
- “finding our wonder inside of the messiness is exactly where we need to tend it most. So tending our joy, tending our wonder is crucial at moments like this.” (Andrea)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Andrea Scher
On Instagram: @AndreaScher
SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST
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Thursday Nov 10, 2022
Thursday Nov 10, 2022
Johnny Crowder is a suicide and abuse survivor. You've probably seen him. He's tatted up, and he's been a TEDx speaker. Johnny’s a billboard charting rock musician and a certified Recovery peer specialist. But what he's most known for is as the founder and CEO of Cope Notes, which is an online mental health platform that provides daily support to people in over 100 countries around the world.
If you have ever doubted whether you matter (and let’s be honest, how many of us haven’t?), this episode will be a balm for you. Johnny brings rock n roll vibes, vulnerability and a wisdom beyond his years to this emotional and essential conversation.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet Johnny
- [4:31] Johnny’s reflections on how entrepreneurship is one of the most challenging of human experiences
- [5:57] Johnny’s relationship with his mental health (“not lovers, but roommates”)
- [8:14] Traci’s own experiences with her mental health
- [11:16] Johnny’s simple realisation that inspired him to create Cope Notes
- [13:11] Tech companies and rock stars (Johnny’s unique way of bringing together his identities)
- [18:29] What Johnny’s learnt about human needs for connection
- [20:48] Johnny’s reflections on his (and our) needs for relationship and support
- [27:47] Johnny’s experience of sexual abuse… and then eventually starting a romantic relationship
- [34:52] The familiarity of drama and intensity when we don’t believe we matter
- [40:12] How the You Matter sentiment would solve 90% of human suffering
- [41:21] Closing
- [42:58] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Why I don’t want to die anymore (Johnny’s Tedx Talk)
Standout Quotes
- “I would estimate that entrepreneurship is one of the most physically and mentally and emotionally challenging things and spiritually challenging things that anybody could ever embark on.” (Johnny)
- “Imagine doing like a tough mudder competition where you're like climbing stuff and you're running swimming through this muck and you're exhausted and your feet are blistered and stuff, and you come out the other end, and when you get to the finish line, the finish line is the start of the Boston Marathon. And you're like what?” (Johnny)
- “I actually find people struggling with mental illness to be having a healthy response to a very sick society.” (Traci)
- “So if I really wanted to analyze my fierce pursuit of changing the world, it is half because I have a deep empathy for people who are just feeling the same kind of stuff that I am. But there has to be some component in there that I'm not aware of that's, like, wanting to feel like it's a good thing that I was born.” (Johnny)
- “If I felt like I deserved nice things and I was enough and I've done enough, I would be the most chill human being on the planet.” (Johnny)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Johnny Crowder
On Instagram: @JohnnyCrowderLovesYou
SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST
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Tuesday Oct 25, 2022
Tuesday Oct 25, 2022
Amanda Ripley is a New York Times bestselling author, an investigative journalist, and the co-founder of Good Conflict, LLC. She writes for the Atlantic, the Washington Post, and Politico, and she spent a decade writing about human behavior for Time magazine in New York, Washington, and Paris.
Listen in as Amanda and Traci explore what High Conflict is (and how we get out) drawing on research, insights, and experience across astronauts on space missions (yes, really!), the Israeli-Palestine conflict, intimate relationships across political divides, gang warfare, and racism.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet Amanda
- [3:44] Amanda’s journey to becoming a writer - and how she’s not like Stephen King
- [8:14] Journalism, Conflict Entrepreneurship, and our need to matter
- [10:17] Gossip: the art of creating intimacy through a common enemy
- [11:46] Conflict in space missions (NASA studies with astronauts)
- [15:09] “Us versus them” and dehumanization
- [15:50] Curtis Toller’s story of gang rivalry… and redemption
- [19:38] The paradox of internal and external conflict
- [22:00] The “exhausted majority” who want less toxicity in politics
- [23:40] Sidewalk Talk’s Wish you knew Me project, designed for couples who have conflict around politics or vaccines
- [27:12] Bringing Black and white communities together in the wake of George Floyd’s murder
- [29:20] The impact of positional power on the need to be heard
- [31:38] The art of political speech
- [33:35] Social media and automatic responses
- [39:32] Friendship, stereotyping, and how a lack of listening shuts down conversations
- [41:35] Learning to dialogue differently around issues of righteous callout… like racism, vaccines, mask-wearing.
- [45.09] Amanda’s message to the Sidewalk Talk volunteers
- [47:14] Closing
- [48:01] Outro
Resources Mentioned
High Conflict: Why we get trapped, and how we get out (Amanda’s book)
Standout Quotes
- “you'll never get out of external conflict until you work on the internal conflict” (Amanda)
- “I feel like that's why we're in this situation. We'd rather just continue othering.” (Traci)
- “Meanwhile there's this “exhausted majority”... who really want major social change and they want less toxicity in the conflict. So both at once they don't necessarily want moderation or centrism, but they want less toxicity, less dehumanization.” (Amanda)
- “There’s something like 40 million Americans who stopped speaking to someone in their lives over the 2016 election.” (Traci)
- “So we're not marrying, dating, or living next to or working with people of other political persuasions is a big problem.” (Traci)
- “yes, you shouldn't let people get away with saying racist things. And what do you say in response? Like, where is the skill, the craft, the learning, the education, the nuance of sophistication emotional, intellectual around what you say, how you respond to that?” (Amanda)
- “We could make lasting change that really solves racism in America or dehumanization of any kind by developing the capacity to dialogue differently.” (Traci)
- “When you really listen to someone, even if you disagree, there is something that opens up. There's an opening that happens in your mind and in your heart. And most people who experience that kind of opening across a big difference want more of it. It's almost like a drug, like a very good drug.” (Amanda)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Amanda Ripley
At https://www.amandaripley.com/
On Twitter: @AmandaRipley
SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST
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Wednesday Oct 19, 2022
Wednesday Oct 19, 2022
Michele Gelfand is a Professor at Stanford University, and an expert on negotiation and cross-cultural psychology. Her book Rule Makers, Rule Breakers explores how tight and loose cultures wire our world, and in doing so offers unique insights on how we might bridge today’s cultural divides.
Michele and Traci chat about the impact of culture on everything from international negotiation to couple’s arguments over chores… in a wide-ranging and fascinating conversation that might just shift how you see yourself and the people around you.
Episode Timeline
- [00:09] Intro
- [0:58] Meet Michele
- [3:33] “Tight” and “loose” culture as a puzzle
- [5:25] Michele and Traci share traveling stories and how they illuminate cultural differences (and subcultural similarities)
- [8:58] What is culture?
- [10:19] How countries develop a tight or loose culture
- [12:17] How understanding culture can create empathy
- [16:27] The polarization at play in the USA’s culture
- [17:40] Why experiencing threat can lead people to want a tighter culture
- [19:31] Michele shares the behind-the-scenes of a fascinating study challenging the views of people from Pakistan and the USA have of each other
- [21:33] Cultural intelligence as a way of connecting more deeply
- [26:32] How tight and loose cultures responded to the pandemic
- [29:16] Getting curious about psychology in international negotiating
- [34:07] Negotiations in couples (the impact of leaning tight or loose)
- [35:45] Household chores and the surprising thing they reveal about attitudes and culture
- [40:51] The relationship between rules and social class
- [44:48] Michele’s life advice (including a touching reflection from her late father-in-law)
- [47:35] Closing
- [48:01] Outro
Resources Mentioned
Rule Makers, Rule Breakers (Michele’s book)
Standout Quotes
- “Cultural intelligence is critical for connection because then you're really open-minded to people's lives and why they evolved the way they did. And it's really hard sometimes not to be judgmental.” (Michele)
- “In the US, individualism and doing your own thing is so part of the culture. And partly it's something that we've inherited because we have more wealth than other cultures and so in contexts where there's not a lot of wealth, you need to have strong support. You need to kind of help out the family. Like, it's just absolutely necessary.” (Michele)
- “there's less debt and there's less alcoholism, less obesity in tighter cultures.” (Michele)
- “loose cultures did far worse during COVID. But loose cultures are really open and creative and tolerant.” (Michele)
Connect:
Find | Sidewalk Talk
On Instagram: @sidewalktalkorg
On Twitter: @sidewalktalkorg
Find | Traci Ruble
On Instagram: @TraciRubleMFT
On Twitter: @TraciRubleMFT
On Facebook: @TraciRubleMFT
Find | Michele Gelfand
At https://www.michelegelfand.com/
On Twitter: @MicheleJGefland
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